Shadow Lord
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« on: February 26, 2011, 10:29:58 PM » |
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Hello,
Does anyone have nay info on the 2.00 DSP upgrade? Is it a chip you can just get from any where? Was it an EPROM or actual processor? If it is an EPROM can one program/roll his own EPROM form an image? I have a CT1320 w/ the 1.05 DSP and CMS chips and would like to upgrade it to the 2.00 DSP. From my understanding, this should be pretty much the same as a SB 2.0 CT1350 w/ CMS chips.
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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Mau1wurf1977
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« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2011, 10:32:36 PM » |
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Are there benefits?
Maybe a major bug that was addressed?
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2011, 10:43:59 PM » |
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Like my OP said it supposedly makes a 1.5 behave like a 2.0 w/ the auot-init DMA and higher freq. for recording and playback.
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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Mau1wurf1977
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« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2011, 11:00:38 PM » |
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w/ the auot-init DMA and higher freq. for recording and playback.
What impact does this have when it comes to playing DOS (Sierra) games? |
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2011, 11:02:29 PM » |
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What impact does this have when it comes to playing DOS (Sierra) games?
Do you have a 2.00 DSP you have that you want ot give me or sell? |
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« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 01:33:47 AM by Shadow Lord »
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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shock__
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« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2011, 12:12:32 AM » |
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How would one check the version used on their card? I have 2 CT1320C cards and could check if one of them has the upgrade done to them (the one I have up for sale seems to be a 1.05), the other has a sticker obscuring the chip (which is most likely a 1.05 I suppose). According to wikipedia the DSP is in fact an Intel 8051 which is a microprocessor with 4/8kb ROM (possibly with an EEPROM version around looking at the prototype). Everything else would be guesswork from my side. |
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Mau1wurf1977
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« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2011, 12:22:52 AM » |
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Some games report the DSP version when you are in the SETUP program.
E.g. Descent or Dark Forces or one of these games. You do an auto detect and it tells you the DSP version!
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2011, 12:27:25 AM » |
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How would one check the version used on their card? I have 2 CT1320C cards and could check if one of them has the upgrade done to them (the one I have up for sale seems to be a 1.05), the other has a sticker obscuring the chip (which is most likely a 1.05 I suppose). According to wikipedia the DSP is in fact an Intel 8051 which is a microprocessor with 4/8kb ROM (possibly with an EEPROM version around looking at the prototype). Everything else would be guesswork from my side. Based on my reading, and by no means is this definitive, it's etched on the chip. The DSP is the long chip right under the SB logo. On mine for example it says version 1.05. The 2.00 should say version 2.00 on it. Are you saying that there is an Intel 8051 chip w/ EEPROMs for prototyping? If that is the case then one could feasibly dump a 2.00 DSP and then burn it on the EEPROM 8051. EDIT: You can also use diagnose.exe if the card is already installed! |
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« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 12:28:51 AM by Shadow Lord »
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2011, 12:30:32 AM » |
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Hmmm... Seems as if the 8051 has a security bit that prevents dumping.
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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shock__
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« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2011, 12:42:28 AM » |
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Are you saying that there is an Intel 8051 chip w/ EEPROMs for prototyping? If that is the case then one could feasibly dump a 2.00 DSP and then burn it on the EEPROM 8051. That's just guesswork, but the way the sticker is put on the chip, used on the prototype, looks typical for EEPROM windows. One could ask the guy who is currently in possession of that card to double-check, but I guess we wouldn't want him to harm it  DSP version on the prototype is 1.03 by the way. Also comparing This close-up of the probable update with the 1.05 DSP one can see the 2.0 one has a different copyright note (Intel 1980 vs. Intel 80, 82) we probably can assume the 2.0 DSP upgrade uses another chip based upon the 8051. Anyways, gonna check the other card tomorrow, as it's 2:40am here already If the 8051 has a security bit, we could possibly knock nicely at Creative Labs door, if they want to make the source public, even tho I doubt they care. |
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« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 12:44:40 AM by shock__ »
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2011, 12:55:54 AM » |
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That's just guesswork, but the way the sticker is put on the chip, used on the prototype, looks typical for EEPROM windows. One could ask the guy who is currently in possession of that card to double-check, but I guess we wouldn't want him to harm it DSP version on the prototype is 1.03 by the way. Also comparing This close-up of the probable update with the 1.05 DSP one can see the 2.0 one has a different copyright note (Intel 1980 vs. Intel 80, 82) we probably can assume the 2.0 DSP upgrade uses another chip based upon the 8051. Anyways, gonna check the other card tomorrow, as it's 2:40am here already If the 8051 has a security bit, we could possibly knock nicely at Creative Labs door, if they want to make the source public, even tho I doubt they care. I thought you alread sold yours? I doubt creative will give u anything if their performance on the CT1350 CMS upgrade is any indication. But one can always ask! |
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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shock__
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« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2011, 01:02:14 AM » |
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I thought you alread sold yours?
I doubt creative will give u anything if their performance on the CT1350 CMS upgrade is any indication. But one can always ask!
Nopes, I currently still have both, waiting for someone to respond for a possible trade. Thinking about the 3rd chip on the CT1350 (which is probably just a GAL/PAL) and the CT1320 being fully discrete, shouldn't it be "relatively easy" to reverse engineer that chip? Gotta have to take a close look at both cards with my multimeter tomorrow! If it's as easy as I think, a friend of mine might be able to build the source for a compatible GAL relatively quick. |
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« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 01:05:46 AM by shock__ »
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2011, 01:36:27 AM » |
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Nopes, I currently still have both, waiting for someone to respond for a possible trade.
Thinking about the 3rd chip on the CT1350 (which is probably just a GAL/PAL) and the CT1320 being fully discrete, shouldn't it be "relatively easy" to reverse engineer that chip?
Gotta have to take a close look at both cards with my multimeter tomorrow!
If it's as easy as I think, a friend of mine might be able to build the source for a compatible GAL relatively quick.
Shock, Are you saying you have the CMS upgrade for a CT1350? I know there was a long discussion on this topic on this forum a while back which sort of fizzled out. If you can dump and duplicate the chip there will be a legion of grateful retro/vintage gamers that will be thanking you! |
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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shock__
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« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2011, 02:16:17 AM » |
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Shock,
Are you saying you have the CMS upgrade for a CT1350?
I know there was a long discussion on this topic on this forum a while back which sort of fizzled out. If you can dump and duplicate the chip there will be a legion of grateful retro/vintage gamers that will be thanking you!
No I don't ... at least not directly (but know at least 2 people who own the official Creative upgrade package). BUT owning a CT1320C and a CT1350B one should be able to see/figure out (by redrawing the schematics) what exactly that 3rd upgrade chip does so one could program a generic GAL/PAL to do just what the Creative chip does. Might take a little bit, but certainly should be possible ... afterall people like ATI and others incorporated simple 2 chip CMS upgrades on their Soundblaster clones 15 years ago If you could link me that other thread, that would be awesome, so I can possibly benefit from what others figured already. |
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« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 02:17:04 AM by shock__ »
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2011, 06:53:00 AM » |
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CMS incorporation is easy. CMS emulation is easy as well. It is already in DOS Box, but recreating the bridge chip for the SB 2.0 might be a bit harder. As far as I am concerned I hope you are right and you ahve it done ASAP! Here is the link to the dicssusions: http://queststudios.com/smf/index.php/topic,2656.0.htmlMostly on the first page and also on this link: http://queststudios.com/smf/index.php/topic,1148.0.html |
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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endre1952
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« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2011, 02:17:57 PM » |
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If someone figures out how to make the upgrade chip, I would be interested in upgrading my SB 2.0 as well.
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« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 02:18:12 PM by endre1952 »
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shock__
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« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2011, 02:37:30 PM » |
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From what I read in those other threads it's a bit harder than I thought, but still quite possible.
Expect to hear something in the next 2 weeks.
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Great Hierophant
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« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2011, 04:57:30 PM » |
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The only function which the PAL should serve is to provide extra addressing logic for the CMS chips. Like my OP said it supposedly makes a 1.5 behave like a 2.0 w/ the auot-init DMA and higher freq. for recording and playback. Partially correct. It does provide auto-init DMA, but does not provide the higher audio frequency support of a true 2.0 (which uses a 2.01 DSP). |
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Shadow Lord
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« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2011, 06:10:04 PM » |
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Thanks for clarifying GH. The best solution, IMHO, is still a CT1350 w/ the CMS upgrade. That should cover you 98-99% of the time and give you most features. Of course for 100% coverage you would need period specific machines w/ period specific cards (e.g. Game Blaster, SB Pro) but that is beyond this poor soul! |
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Wishes: 1. IBM 7531 2. SB 1.5 DSP 2.00 Kit 3. SB 1.5 C/MS Kit 4. SB 2.0 C/MS Kit 5. Copy II PC EOB (w/ switch on the back) 6. Elsa Winner 2000 w/ 4MB EISA.
If you have the above for sale please PM me. Thanks!
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endre1952
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« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2011, 07:07:13 PM » |
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I've got a 386SX-40, that's rather period specific, it's it? My VGA-sound card days started with a 286 25MHZ in 1991 I think, that was replaced a year later by a 386-DX40. I've got both the dual OPL2 and the OPL3 versions of SB Pro. I've got lots of Roland modules but only an MPU-IPC-T ISA midi card at the moment (installed in my 386SX-40).
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